"Gun advocates think they know how any scenario involving guns will play out. They don't."


cliff schecter on last word guns gun advocates

In one of the following letters, the author refers to "gun advocates." I prefer the terms gun fondlers, gun zealots, and gun fetishists, but what do I know, right? She makes a great point, as do the others in today's Los Angles Times letters to the editor.

Take a look at these and at the video below, because our voices matter:

Near the end of your article on the Las Vegas shootings, you mention Joseph Robert Wilcox, who pulled out a concealed weapon and confronted Jerad Miller at the Wal-Mart.

As I read this part of the article, I wondered what gun advocates who promote the fallacy that the only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun would say about that. Wilcox may have believed this idea and might have wanted to be a hero, but now he is dead after having been shot by a bad guy.

Gun advocates think they know how any scenario involving guns will play out. They don't.

Unfortunately, this part of the story will not even be part of the conversation. It is to our country's detriment that it won't be.

Nancy Zaman, Los Angeles


The politicians' angry cries against the release of five Guantanamo Bay detainees are loud. What of the American terrorists who routinely slaughter children, police officers and innocent civilians?

Those politicians refuse to defy their sponsor, the National Rifle Assn., and show little care for American lives.

Ruth Palanker, Los Angeles


Isn't it about time that we just stand up to the defenders of an amendment written more than 200 years ago and say it just doesn't apply anymore? Isn't it time for the cowards in Washington to quit protecting the NRA and start protecting the rest of us?

It's time we closed the gun shops and the gun shows and started restricting and shutting down the manufacturers of these weapons.

And yes, it is a mental health issue. It's about the absolute insanity of the people who think that owning a gun somehow makes you more of an American.

Collect the guns and get these nuts off the street before more of our children die.

Lee Cohen, Glendale

Now take a look at our own Cliff Schecter making the case against violence on The Last Word. As always, he knocked it out of the park:

  • "Believe what you want to believe, Baby!"

    That's the Fox tagline, rather terrible try.

  • moral DK

    Even left-wing CNN says it's bunk. Believe what you want to believe, Baby!

  • Sherry Hardy

    Brava! I'll holster m'pistolios. Thought Texas grew tougher cats. 😉 All hat … etc etc etc. Love that you guys have gotten 'gun fondler' firmly into the vernacular, right where it ought to be with the other accurate terms for the Obsessed.

  • Standing O.

    And if this troll returns, he'll be banned like the others. They never seem to grasp our guidelines. We don't allow trolls here. ADDED: Actually, I didn't wait for him to return.

  • That's funny Tex! To quote the president, please proceed.

    To use an apt metaphor, the more you comment the more you shoot yourself in the foot.

    Actually, never mind. We won't be receiving any more comments from you. Ever.

  • TexTopCat

    "needless deaths" - I know that gun owners care about the lives lost in those "gun free zones". Sorry that you do not care enough to do something to actually protect the victims rather than the criminals.

  • Nice try, but not true. What is true is that insulting the other side makes gun fondlers, gun zealots, and gun fetishsts might me they like us (I'm also anti-gun craziness) less but it invalidates the argument in no way whatsoever. Assuming that you're a gun fondler yourself, you don't agree with the position to begin with so why should we worry about your feelings? We're not a news organization, we're a liberal, progressive blog.

  • TexTopCat

    "liberal blog" - OK, so you are saying liberals do not care about truth or justice? You think that the best that liberals are capable of is calling people names without any evidence? You think being responsible if not something that citizens should be?
    Well, I guess that you have a much lower view of liberals that I do.

  • Back atcha, Ace!

  • Yes, I am bigoted... against needless deaths. That's very pro-life of me, isn't it?

    The title is a direct quote from the author of a letter, by the way, not something I thought of. I wish I had though. Maybe if you'd read the letter, you'd have caught that. I felt it was worth repeating in the headline.

    Speaking of infantile, should any of you choose to return with equally fallacious comments or insults as some of you have written here, you'll be banned. Read our guidelines. We don't do RW talking points here. We don't do baiting in Comments here. We engage civilly and factually. We've backed up our posts with documentation should you choose to do a search of previous posts and links.

    As for millions of people "of arms"... whatever that means... yes, they do know what they're doing, and those people are reasonable and safety-conscious. But sadly, there are millions of others who don't fit that description. It is those people we are addressing in our "infantile" posts.

    Thanks for dropping by.

  • No, the 74 school shootings is an accurate number. You're the one who has fallen for the drivel coming from Fox. Nice try.

  • Hey "Tex"... et al.. This is a liberal blog where we express liberal opinions. You don't like those? Then go read Breitbart or some other right wing site that satisfies your needs. Apparently guns don't do that for you, you seem to need more validation to compensate for your apparent impotence.

    But hey, thanks for the meaningless comments, guys. We expected nothing else from gun fondlers, gun zealots, and gun fetishists, which is exactly what many of you are. No exaggeration, no hype. Fact.

  • ijoined2downvote

    Insulting the other side of any issue immediately invalidates any point you were attempting to make.

  • TexTopCat

    When you start an article out by calling 1/2 the population names like "gun fondlers, gun zealots, and gun fetishists", does this author anything else he may say will have any impact? It would seem that any organization that is in the publishing business would force authors to fact check the article from creditable sources before publication. Apparently in this case, the article was just another press release from Bloomberg. Too, bad he did not stay on his "big gulp" project and leave the rest of us alone.

  • Mark O'Connor

    The president said there was no way for the town to stop it, only there was, but the government infringed upon what shouldn't have been. Last week a school mass shooting was stopped in six seconds because a gun was immediately available to stop it. New town went on for nine minutes.

    It's obvious that its not the children antis are interested in saving. Reading the article, the author gleefully cheers the fact that an armed good citizen is killed as he saved lives, which is a fact established by the local Las Vegas Sheriff. It's a fact that armed citizens had saved lives and prevented mass shootings before, however, antis deny it because it deflates their statistics much like the deflated "74 school shootings since Newtown" that is still being touted above.

    Comparing Australia to the US is a silly argument. Regardless, mass killings in Australia still occur, mostly by a different means.

    -Childers Palace Fire - In June 2000, drifter and con-artist Robert Long started a fire at the Childers Palace backpackers hostel that killed 15 people.

    -Churchill Fire - 10 confirmed deaths due to a deliberately lit fire. The fire was lit on 7th of February 2009.

    -Quakers Hill Nursing Home Fire - 10 confirmed and as many as 21 people may have died as a result of a deliberately lit fire in a Quakers Hill nursing home. The fire was lit early on 18th of November 2011.

    And there has been a mass shooting since their ban:

    -Monash University shooting - In
    October 2002, Huan Yun Xiang, a student, shot his classmates and teacher, killing two and injuring five.

    Some things to consider before comparing the US and Australia:
    Population (more people more crime)
    US: 318,892,103
    Au: 22,262,501
    (July 2013 est.)

    The US is a republic that is based on individual liberty backed by our constitution.
    Australia is a constitutional monarch where the people are subjects to the crown.

    With that in mind, "If Australia jumped off a bridge, should we jump too?" Hardly. We don't need an entire nation resembling Chicago.

  • Of course they say nothing about Mike Bloomberg's armed security. Hypocrites.

  • moral DK

    I've never seen such a large bunch of moon-bat left wing drivel. Quote "The Onion". Really? Is that where you get your hard news, Cliffy?

    Anyone can make up statistics to back their cause. The "74 school shootings" has been debunked by right and left news sources. Hey, I think I just heard a gun shot and we're only six miles from a school! That makes 75!

    I guess when you have no facts, no reasoning and no common sense, you have to make it up as you go along. Is it any wonder why no one watches MSNBC?

  • The title of this
    bigoted author's article is simply infantile, and the quotes he gives show an
    angry collective ostrich with its head in the sand. You will not make any
    progress until you come to terms with the people themselves and what they stand
    for, and get past the fixation on the "gun lobby" bogeyman.
    There are many millions of people of arms and they know quite well what
    they are doing and why, and furthermore they are quite logical and rational
    about it, and maybe it's the chagrin over that that keeps the antis in denial.